To Hell With Canada

Seems like all that time in the Nazi party did have an effect on GMS Simon the great Dalai Seng Shi.

"Seems like all that time in the Nazi party did have an effect on GMS Simon the great Dalai Seng Shi." That's slander. He fought in the German army in WWII. Just about all able-bodied German men did at that time. He was NOT a Nazi. There's a huge difference.

"That's slander. He fought in the German army in WWII. Just about all able-bodied German men did at that time. He was NOT a Nazi. There's a huge difference." - Vortexx Sorry but I stand behind what I stated about him being a Nazi. In terms of ideology, Nazism combines racialism, nationalism, anti-Semitism and anti-communism, and draws from a variety of other sources. The only thing missing from his book is anti-semitism. 20 years after WWII and he actually publishes this garbage. This idiot is stating that Natives are not true Homosapiens basically that they are subhuman...don't you think that this parallels what the Nazi's were saying about the Jews? You should be God Damn ashamed that you are trying to make excuses for His Holiness the Dalai Seng Shi Olaf Simon. Life with the Nazi's clearly left their mark on him. Do you want me to embarass you with a few quotes from his book? Ok...here goes: Against Homosexuals: 1. "How would you like to see the army train 'homosexual shock troops'? (We used to have pride in our army.) These are the developments of the near future. A few test cases are presently in court in the United States. Depending on the outcome we can be certain that if the court favours keeping these freaks together with the normal men someone will get hurt. Who wishes to be surrounded by them other than their own kind? What General can still argue the question as to the high standard of morals in his unit?" - O. E. Simon - Page 93 (To Hell with Canada?) 2. "Homosexual persons shall never be married by the temple, since they do not follow the natural order within the universe: they are a man-made unity, impotent in their own attempts to create succession through their own souls, minds and bodies,... The temple has certain provisions for members with unnatural afflictions such as homosexuality..." - O. E. Simon Pg 4-5 (Neo Ch'an book) Against Blacks: 3. "While viewing a certain television program I witnessed a food giveaway in a large American City: in fact, it happened to be a part of the 'Hearst Affair'. The Hearst family had to distribute food to the allegedly starving public in order to meet the demands of certain terrorists. There were dozens of Aunt Jemimas battling over whatever fell from the food trucks. They were most certainly not starving! It is amazing how the fur coat has become the symbol of an elegant woman. You can now see them sold by the thousands to anyone having the loot. I have seen pink slacks and runners as a match up for a mink coat. The 'hoodlum broads' also like furs along with cheap diamond jewellery..." - O. E. Simon - Page 39-40 (To Hell with Canada?) Against Native People: 4. (discussing natives in Canada) "This nonsense about genocide and other talk is so stupid that one needs to waste no paper or time with it. I am certain if we inbreed for several thousands of years that we will have a being very much compared to the Indians of the Amazon who have lost the capability of focusing their eyes on a moving object and can hardly be considered to be in the true sense homosapiens." - O. E. Simon - Page 26 (To Hell with Canada?) 5. "Tens of thousands of square miles have recently been allotted to these natives. In some cases our pioneers who had settled had to give up their land or will soom be facing this possibility....It is time the Canadian government realizes this fact and stops treating the Indians as a privelidged people in this country. Before our pioneers arrived here the Indians were already engaged in tribal warfare and the scalping of one's opponent was not invented by the settlers." - O. E. Simon (To Hell with Canada?) 6. "The whiteman, if you please, has conquered this country without shooting, without war. The primitive Indian culture had very little to offer to the Europeans who lived to learn about Greece and Rome, Egypt, Israel, Persia and even Africa." - O. E. Simon (To Hell with Canada?) 7. "There is most certainly poverty in any society. The Indians are to blame for theirs." - O. E. Simon (To Hell with Canada?) 8. "Our Indians invented nothing of great significance" - O. E. Simon (To Hell with Canada?) OK Vortexx....I'd love to hear what you have to say.

1 & 2: You have to remember when To Hell With Canada? was written. It was way before political correctness. How many people from GMS's generation approve of homosexuality? Very few. You can be sure that that was the predominant view back then. Even now it is. Consider the Catholic Church and the Pope. Most of Christianity considers it sinful, unnatural behaviour coming from the devil. In many countries homosexuality is still illegal. In many others you'll get stoned to death for it. I personally do not share these views on homosexuality, but there are billions that do. GMS was simply bold enough to voice his opinion. 3: He's just rambling here. I really don't see anything prejudiced in his statements. In fact, I'm not even sure what point he's trying to make. 4: He's not discussing natives in Canada, but the Indians of the Amazon (which is in South America, in case you're rusty in your geography). There are Indian tribes there that have had practically no contact with the outside world. They are, as GMS says, very inbred. They rely much more on instinct than on reason. They would be completely incapable of surviving in any civilized community (probably as most of us wouldn't be able to survive in their environment). In that way they are very different from us. I don't think GMS's statements are so far from the truth. The terminology he used may not be the best in a politically correct world, but for thousands of years these people have evolved in a completely different way from all the other homosapiens, adapting to their own unique environment. 5: I agree with that view completely. I don't think natives should be treated as a privileged class. 6: I mostly agree with this view as well. The natives had a special connection with nature and spirituality, plus a good knowledge of herbal medicine. Other than that, their culture was very primitive. Many tribes were mostly busy scalping each other when the Europeans arrived. 7: I agree completely. Everyone should take responsibility for his own life. 8: Again, I agree with this. What did the Indians invent? So what's so embarrassing about these views? For the time they were written, they were absolutely natural. Even now most people will agree with the majority of what he says. If you think his opinions make him a Nazi, than most of the world are Nazis.

Vortexx, It is sad that you actually side with the pathetic megalomaniac Olaf Simon. I do not mean to insult you but did you finish high school? You take Simon's words literally but he has a deeper more sinister meaning behind his words. "1 & 2: You have to remember when To Hell With Canada? was written. It was way before political correctness. How many people from GMS's generation approve of homosexuality? Very few. You can be sure that that was the predominant view back then. Even now it is. Consider the Catholic Church and the Pope. Most of Christianity considers it sinful, unnatural behaviour coming from the devil. In many countries homosexuality is still illegal. In many others you'll get stoned to death for it. I personally do not share these views on homosexuality, but there are billions that do. GMS was simply bold enough to voice his opinion." - Vortexx Your great GMS Simon is promoting hatred to homosexuals. He calls them "freaks". He also says, "The temple has certain provisions for members with unnatural afflictions such as homosexuality..." What is he suggesting...a gas Chamber in Grand Forks? You call him bold but I call him a hate-mongerer. Simon clearly infers in paragraph one that he supports homosexuals being seperated from the rest of society. The fact of the matter is that since Western society and its government were founded on the notion of the separation of church and state, to encode in a secular law an idea that has purely religious purposes, is a clear violation of the principle of the separation of church and state. Until the religionist can come up with a sound reason why society benefits by the outlawing of homosexual activity, then there is no moral basis for such a law if one accepts the principle of religious freedom as encoded in the doctrine of the separation of church and state. "3: He's just rambling here. I really don't see anything prejudiced in his statements. In fact, I'm not even sure what point he's trying to make." - Vortexx I find it pathetic that you cannot see past his literal words. Olaf is trying to depict blacks as lazy and irresponsible. "4...There are Indian tribes there that have had practically no contact with the outside world. They are, as GMS says, very inbred. They rely much more on instinct than on reason. They would be completely incapable of surviving in any civilized community (probably as most of us wouldn't be able to survive in their environment). In that way they are very different from us. I don't think GMS's statements are so far from the truth. The terminology he used may not be the best in a politically correct world, but for thousands of years these people have evolved in a completely different way from all the other homosapiens, adapting to their own unique environment." - Vortexx I can't believe that you agree with Olaf Simon that there are cultures out there that because they are different than us that they should be classified as close to sub-human. This was the Nazi's racial ideology that was used to committ genocide against the Jewish people. "5: I agree with that view completely. I don't think natives should be treated as a privileged class." - Vortexx Native people are subject to the general law of the land, together with other Canadians, unless there is some aboriginal, treaty or other provision affording special protection. If a law conflicts with native lifestyle or culture, and there is no special protection, the courts will apply that law to natives. What special treatment are you opposed to and why? "6: I mostly agree with this view as well. The natives had a special connection with nature and spirituality, plus a good knowledge of herbal medicine. Other than that, their culture was very primitive. Many tribes were mostly busy scalping each other when the Europeans arrived." - Vortexx Don't you think that the Natives were just at a different developmental stage than the Europeans. I beg to differ that they had little to offer. "7: I agree completely. Everyone should take responsibility for his own life." - Vortexx Agreed that an individual has to take responsibility for pulling themselves up but Natives are not solely to blame for their poverty. Why don't you read up on Native Poverty and see the numerous social and economical reasons why natives have a high percentage of poverty. "8: Again, I agree with this. What did the Indians invent?" - Vortexx Well....how about: A. Nearly half the major staples of the world come from Native people. Over 300 varieties of food, such as: Corn (including popping corn), beans (haudenosaunne had 60 varieties), squash, turkey, wild fruits such as: cranberries, blueberries, strawberries, wild rice, potatoes (sent to Ireland creating a great farming industry for them), sweet potatoes, melons, pumpkins, sweet potatoes, wild rice, sunflowers, a wide variety of nuts (including peanuts), maple sap, tobacco, cocoa, peppers, maize, agave, tomatoes. Today, 60% of the world's food are of Turtle Island origin. It was these diverse foods that saved the lives of the Europeans who often arrived riddled with disease. B. Northern Woodlands Native people ‘invented’ the first diapers because they knew that sphagnum moss absorbed much liquid. Sphagnum was also used instead of cotton wadding in front-line hospitals during WW1. C. Natives provided quinine as the first effective treatment of malaria and utilized many plants that have resulted in remarkable contributions to 20th century medicine including aspirin­related tree bark (white willow) extracts, laxatives, painkillers, antibacterial medicines, petroleum jelly and others. D. Birchbark canoes and snowshoes allowed the European explorers to move about with relative ease. E. Art and Music and numerous other inventions and contributions that I do not know of. I think the contribution of 60% of the food that the today's world eats is contribution enough for one society. Vortexx, believing in the Moh style is great if it works for you. I personally don't put much stock into it. That is just my opinion. You may think otherwise but that is just your opinion too. It is distressing that you have also chosen Simon's ignorant path towards other cultures.

TKF_PHS I dont think you need to insult VORTEXX on his level of education. And i also want to thank you for educating me in the fact that Canadian indians invented boats, music arts and food. My wife is Native and I am sure she will be very happy when she learns her people invented food. shawn

Sifu Shawn, I am not insulting Vortexx but asking a question. I did find your last post quite funny. I did not mean to say that Natives invented food, music etc, but perhaps you could extrapolate that my answer did not only include inventions but also contributions to today's society. I did clarify in my last example: "E. Art and Music and numerous other inventions and contributions that I do not know of." - TKF_PHS I also stated: "I think the contribution of 60% of the food that the today's world eats is contribution enough for one society." - TKF_PHS The point I was making in my rebuttal was to Olaf's statement: "8. "Our Indians invented nothing of great significance" - O. E. Simon (To Hell with Canada?)" He was inferring that Natives did not give anything of any significance to Cdn culture and society. I was merely citing items from the past, both inventions and contributions, which do have an impact on us in the modern world and I look forward to their contributions to our society in the future. I am sorry that you took it so literally...I'm glad I don't use metaphors on this forum.

Sifu Shawn, Just wondering....do you agree with Olaf's ideas in his book, ..To Hell with Canada? Do his words ring true for you? Do they inspire you?

Although I don't agree with many things that Simon represents or has said, something I did hear him say many times over rings true for me when I read this thread and TKF_PHS's posts. "The masses are asses" "All they need is an agitator to turn them into a violent mob" You, TKF_PHS, are an agitator.

TKF_PHS I am glad you found my last post funny. I found your 1 statement kind of comical to they way it came across thats why I could not resist. No I honestly did not find any words of real inspiration in his book. But It was not all false what I read either. But my wife is native, and i am not into hate propaganda if thats what you are wondering??? And if you need to use metaphors, go ahead I am not dumb. I just couldn't resist bugging you abaout natives inventing food...... its to funny... shawn

Grasshopper, Why do you say that I am an agitator? I am trying to discuss Olaf Simon's greatest piece of literary work on a public forum. Just like a book club. He does have a "PhD" in Literature from the Gena University. Any scholar would be happy that their work is provoking thought...even if they just spout out hate propaganda. No need to feel agitated. Just state your opinion. Besides, what's agitating about Grand Master Simon, the Dalai Seng Shi, 23 Successor of the Tookien Temple, printed words? He did write about his hate promoting ideologies and published it for the general public to read? "All they need is an agitator to turn them into a violent mob...You, TKF_PHS, are an agitator." - Grasshopper Are you part of the violent mob then? Are you upset because you disagree with me and believe in your Grand Master Simon's bigoted words? Do the words in his book inspire you just like Vortexx? Vortexx - I view Olaf as a Nazi. If you look up to him as your mentor and teacher then that's your perogative.

"I do not mean to insult you but did you finish high school?" Actually I hold a University Bachelors degree. I finished all my courses with Honors With Distinction. I've received countless scholarships and top-of-class awards. I read on average a book a week. "You take Simon's words literally but he has a deeper more sinister meaning behind his words." No, you're just out on a witch-hunt, and read much more into those lines than is really there. "The fact of the matter is that since Western society and its government were founded on the notion of the separation of church and state" I agree with you completely, and I've already stated that I don't share GMS's views on homosexuality. At the same time, billions of people do (and practically everybody did back when he wrote those statements). Like I said before, even today most of Christianity believes that homosexuality is unnatural and from the devil. Does that make every Christian a Nazi? "I find it pathetic that you cannot see past his literal words. Olaf is trying to depict blacks as lazy and irresponsible." I find it pathetic how you keep reading more than is actually there. Besides, there are lazy and irresponsible people of any nationality (including Blacks), although historically some ethnic groups are more hard-working and enterprising than others. The more social assistance people do get, the less motivated they are to take responsibility for their lives, and be productive self-sufficient citizens. There are people in both Canada and U.S. that do take advantage of the welfare system, and that's the phenomenon GMS was talking about. "I can't believe that you agree with Olaf Simon that there are cultures out there that because they are different than us that they should be classified as close to sub-human. This was the Nazi's racial ideology that was used to committ genocide against the Jewish people." This is a perfect example of how you read more than is there. Where did I say that Amazon Indians are close to sub-human? All I said is that they have evolved differently from all the other humans, and that they wouldn't be capable of functioning in any civilized community. That's not prejudice, that's fact. "What special treatment are you opposed to and why?" I was agreeing with GMS's statements that they shouldn't be given any more free land and money. "Don't you think that the Natives were just at a different developmental stage than the Europeans." Exactly. That's precisely why they didn't have much to offer to the Europeans apart from the knowledge of their environment. When Columbus discovered the New World, the Mayans had the most advanced and complex civilization in the Americas. But even they were still hundreds if not thousands of years behind the Europeans in most areas. Here's a quote from Wikipedia: "Maya civilization is regarded as the most technologically advanced of all pre-Columbian civilizations in the Americas. It can be classified as a Stone-age civilization which just began experimenting with metals by the time of the Spanish conquest. The lack of draft animals (like the old world domesticated horse, cow, ox, donkey, etc) in the ancient Americas may explain the lack of use of the wheel, which obviated the need for paved roads..." "Agreed that an individual has to take responsibility for pulling themselves up but Natives are not solely to blame for their poverty." Yes, they have been persecuted, abused, and influenced in negative ways in the past. But that doesn't mean they have to be compensated for it generation after generation after generation. There are many Native Americans that are well educated and successful. There are others that keep wallowing in self-pity, blaming all their problems on past abuse, and remain stuck in poverty and alcoholism. The difference is that the first group took responsibility for their own lives, worked hard, were positive, and achieved their goals. "I think the contribution of 60% of the food that the today's world eats is contribution enough for one society." GMS is discussing significant inventions here. Food is not an invention. Most of the plants you've mentioned would still be around even without the natives, and would eventually be discovered by the Europeans. I myself said that the Natives had a good knowledge of herbal medicine. As for the other inventions you mentioned, they can be counted on the fingers of one hand. Remember, we're talking about significant inventions here, so if you don't know of any more, probably they weren't significant enough. Now compare that to the millions of technological inventions and all the progress in science, mathematics, architecture, etc. of the European nations. If the Natives invented birch-bark canoes, the Europeans invented ships which could traverse oceans... The Natives are what they are. I have nothing whatsoever against them, and I consider them in no way inferior. At the same time, I don't see anything particularly false in the statements that GMS makes. If you read more into them than is there, you're the one who's prejudiced. There are Natives, Blacks, Jews, and Arabs that are part of the PHS. The current Calgary chief is part Native, and for several years he has directly represented GMS in the system in his absence. GMS wouldn't hold the highest opinion of him if he considered his race to be sub-human. "Do the words in his book inspire you just like Vortexx?" I never said that the book inspired me. I only pointed out that the comments he made were perfectly natural for the time he made them, and that most of what he said was true, even if not politically correct. Most people with Conservative views would have completely agreed with him. "I view Olaf as a Nazi." Then by your definition most people are Nazis.

"There are Natives, Blacks, Jews, and Arabs that are part of the PHS. The current Calgary chief is part Native, and for several years he has directly represented GMS in the system in his absence. GMS wouldn't hold the highest opinion of him if he considered his race to be sub-human. " - Vortexx GMS is willing to overlook a few things in order to get their money. He spends it wisely too....just look at the Gazebo (in place of the temple) he built on Temple Lands with the Hundreds of thousands of dollars and free labour that he has at his disposal. His business practices, his false titles (Dalai Seng Shi, 23rd successor, Grand Master, Silver Sash holder, "PhD" in literature), all the BS in his books and mind training seminars, lack of integrity and you want me to give him the benefit of the doubt? Sorry...but many others in the academic world view him as a Nazi. You view him as a mentor and a leader of men. He's a real shining light as a leader. I hope you learn a lot from him.

Hello TKF_PHS, I see that you are posting at threads about all three topics on this forum. 1. The art of Moh, how good is it? 2. The business practices of TKF, "How the money is used". 3. The stories, about lineage and the rest. What is it you would like to see from this forum? Are you just debating or are you after something more specific? I mean, I am for the art, against the old biz and couldn't care less about where Moh came from. What are you for? So far, It seems like you are: Against the art, against the biz , Against the stories And want to stir up things here. Is this what you want only, or have I missed something? And let us be clear. As long as you conform to the rules, post away. Regards, MrE2Me2