Hello Grasshopper, You posted, “…Even if a BB student had better skill than a BB student…”. Did you mean, Even if a BB student had better skill than a BB teacher??? You posted, “If we do this list, I think it should be Black Belts or higher only (which it is) and teachers of the Art only, not students.” It is also my opinion that a hierarchy system should include only the teachers. However, the black belt list should include all black belts, teacher or not. In other words, there should be two lists. That would be one of teachers in hierarchy and then another of black belts in alphabetical order. A couple of things would be accomplished this way. One: Those who obtain a black belt in Moh would be given acknowledgement. Two: Teachers of Moh would also be acknowledged. You posted, “So with that in mind some names on this list will need to be removed.” With this alternative in mind, we wouldn’t have do undo anything. You posted, “It is because of these issues that I think we originally avoided doing this sort of thing..” L.O.L.! I believe you warned me when I started this thread. You posted, “We should also indicate those individuals who attained the degree of Master...” That would be cool but it presupposes that we have a specific definition for “Master”. Regards, MrE2Me2 Without prejudice E&OE

Interesting as the standards for Master, Teacher, or black Belt will constantly get challenged The chart should include everyone asscoiated (even though their maybe a separate one for teachers and BBers) However, master could only be related to those by senioirity? Longest practitoners?

I honestly think that we don't have the means to make a complete list. There were so many studios across the US and Canada that to know who all the teachers were would be staggering to try and figure out. Also some teachers were yellow belts who only lasted 3 months and never learned the "Moh knowledge sheets" completely. Some of the names on the current list are 1st degree brown belts by TKF ranking.

Well, I've cast the first stone, now we shall see how far the ripples travel... :twisted:

Like NIKE DO IT

I personally have avoided this thread for the most part because I don't like the list as it is done here. It is very broad and includes instructors & students from 4 different decades North, like you said, many on this list have had their skill fade away over time while others not on the list have far surpassed the ability of those on it. The list on this thread should not be used as an indication of peoples present ability and possibly should be done away with. It's simply a list of people who recieved their Black Belt at TKF or in the style of Moh Kempo, whether they were deserving or not, or have maintained their skill or not, or continue to promote the style or not is not the point of it. Take it or leave Quite frankly, there are some names on the list with whose company I would prefer not to share, maybe you should be thankful you are not on it. PS - perhaps the fact that this thread has had it's formatting screwed up is a message...

No one remembers me...I'm sad :(

Welcome to the Forum THE. L.O.L.! Consider the past forty years of Moh history. It's amazing that anyone talks to anyone else, at all. Regards, MrE2Me2

A credible history
I taught at the Bellevue, Kent and Portland studios from 1990-1993 and have kept all the KFC sheets from those days. I've continued to teach students in the Art I taught at TKF, but have no way of tracing a tangible heritage for them. I would like to offer my students a means of knowing they come from a credible history, even if GMS misrepresented himself. My motivation isn't entirely selfless... I've often lamented that in a world of black belts, certificates and recognition that my only recognition from TKF was my W-2's from when I was employed as an instructor and Chief Instructor of Kent and Portland. I hope the creation of a former instructor roster leads to a way of recognizing those who faithfully taught students in that system, even if we can never go back. -Mr. Ott

Hey monk321 (Mr. Ott) Send me a Private Message with a little more info, like your full name, the name of the school/dojo you own(?)/ teach at, as well as any other Masters you may have known other than MacDonald or Jones. New info for our Moh History is always appreciated. Then I can update the Moh Lineage Tree!! Cheers grasshopper

the list is incomplete but very accurate we in winnipeg were held back not tested and there are more who should be on your list not bashing but the management of the studios were paranoid. when shergold left all his certificates were confiscated

hey mr ott you taught kevin fredrickson who started teaching me along with mike bagwell mr hodgson