So what do you train now?

"We had two names for the “Temple Motions 1-18” The other name was, “The Eighteen Classical Chinese Muscle Change Positions”. " Hey Mystery, The muscle change classics are actually very different then the 18 temple motions that I know. They are five motions that involve a lot of hard breathing with resistance, more simular to a training exercise taught at younger levels called power breathing (on a very basic level). The history of the muscle change classics is they are what Da Mo (Boddidarma) taught to the shaolin, both them and the marrow/brain washing classics. Question, did you train the temple motions with resistance and breathing, that might explain the name. thanks swollenknuck http://www.myspace.com/swollenknuck "Shedding more sweat in peace means less blood in war"

Hello SwollenKnuck, Thanks for the update. I have heard of that version of this form before. I was never taught it though. The 18 temple motions that I was taught was this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Des6cpVowrA And they were supposed to be done as slowly as this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Phke7yj5wGI (Demonstrated here by Sifu Shawn.) But I changed it a bit by speeding them up (a personal preference). In the version I learned, there was no breathing drills, at all. Yet when Sifu Shawn does it, he does have breathing in it. There is a thread devoted to this topic here. http://templekungforum.14.forumer.com/viewtopic.php?t=39&start=25 Regards, MrE2Me2

To all, Here are some of my basic blocks for green belt nowadays. They are used against a committed thrust punch and are followed by a check. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=51QcnnVYxMs Here is the way I train basic swings now. Notice where my arm is when I start the hip movement. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WpjQhyDF_Ko http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iof-_12-wW0 Here is the way I demonstrate after a year of training these same swings. Again, notice where my arm is when I begin my swing. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OkMnm2G2QoA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgRrtmVOKpg Regards, MrE2Me2

To all, Here are the KISAE Kempo stationary secondary blocking and striking sets for green belt. Facing Secondary Strikes: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6cSY6TygFI Side Secondary Strikes: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=72XTmMZhA8k Facing Double Blocks: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GXCfBlodXVc Side Double Blocks: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tGjDplWm4TI Regards, MrE2Me2

Re: SIFU WONG KIEW KIT AND MASTER LIU SIONG
See his Southern Shaolin style @ http://www.wongkk.com/ and his page on certified Canadian instructors. Sifu Wong has published several books and I was wondering if anyone on this website has read any of them. I'd like to hear some feedback about him, his school, and his books. Hi Yen Hui, I have met Sifu Anton Skafer. He has trained under Wong Kiew Kit, and is one of his certified instructors. I took one of his Chin Na classes, although very interesting--was not what I was looking for. I am trying to arrange a meeting with him to find out more about the Kung Fu he offers. He has told me before I can take Kung Fu I must do Chi Kung with him through private lessons. This is not the same format as it was when I had first met him, but his school is small. I am not sure how standard it is. My impression of him was that he is a very grounded individual. I have some friends that are taking instruction from him and are very impressed with his Chi Kung. Both of which have over 10 years Martial Arts experience. I don't have too much more information to offer at this point, but hopefully I will in the near future :D I have been a bit apprehensive about joining another school as I would prefer to build on the knowledge I have rather then start new. I trained at Waterloo Kung Fu for a month last year which was run by, at the time Bob Schneider (he has since passed away which is unfortunate). I had one of his instructors tell me "Kung Fu is pain" which I found ridiculous. Although I went with an open mind, I found it annoying to hear them preach to me how kicks should or should not be done, without recognizing their value or appropriateness in specific situations. I am also investigating attending an Enlightenment Intensive seminar with Lawrence Noyes (http://www.lawrencenoyes.com/) although this would not maintain a martial aspect to it. The course is highly recommended to me from my previous martial arts instructor.

Re: SIFU WONG KIEW KIT AND MASTER LIU SIONG
I trained at Waterloo Kung Fu for a month last year which was run by, at the time Bob Schneider (he has since passed away which is unfortunate). I had one of his instructors tell me "Kung Fu is pain" which I found ridiculous. Although I went with an open mind, I found it annoying to hear them preach to me how kicks should or should not be done, without recognizing their value or appropriateness in specific situations. I am also investigating attending an Enlightenment Intensive seminar with Lawrence Noyes (http://www.lawrencenoyes.com/) although this would not maintain a martial aspect to it. The course is highly recommended to me from my previous martial arts instructor. Hi there Denyuan ~ Many thanks for the very helpful reply! :D My present teacher always stresses "the pain" factor as well. Although he does not administer pain, through direct physical contact, he regularly emphasizes that we must train until it hurts, if we wish to realize maximum growth. He always tells us that's how his masters trained him. They were Old Chinese masters. He's also told us often how he trained 5 hours a day, 6 days a week, not including teaching classes. He tells us that waking up in the morning, so stiff with pain everywhere that he could barely move, was virtually a daily experience with him. He's been training now for over 40 years. He is a 2nd generation disciple of the great Yang Ch'eng-fu, and studied Yang Tai Chi for 10 years before taking up the Five Animals of Shaolin and Wing Chun. He has continued to study Tai Chi throughout the decades and is also adept at TCM. I plan to stay with him, for the time being. I really only want to master the Five Animals and the Three Internal Styles. The Five Animals System was why I originally joined ELS. Still, Denyuan, I'm grateful for your assistance! In the fraternal spirit of Shaolin, Yen Hui

Re: SIFU WONG KIEW KIT AND MASTER LIU SIONG
My present teacher always stresses "the pain" factor as well. Although he does not administer pain, through direct physical contact, he regularly emphasizes that we must train until it hurts, if we wish to realize maximum growth. He always tells us that's how his masters trained him. They were Old Chinese masters. He's also told us often how he trained 5 hours a day, 6 days a week, not including teaching classes. He tells us that waking up in the morning, so stiff with pain everywhere that he could barely move, was virtually a daily experience with him. Yen HuiHi Yen Hui, I have been training Shaolin Wahnam Chi Kung for a few weeks now. This is being taught to me as a required prerequisite before I can train Kung Fu. The views I am being taught are very different than what I have learned about Kung Fu previously. Although I disagree that Kung Fu is pain, I have always fully acknowledged that there is pain while training Kung Fu. Kung Fu, for me has been more about energetic, or Chi Flow while performing during movements or sparring. Not the pain. Shaolin Wahnam teaches me that in Kung Fu there should never be any pain. If there is pain, you are training wrong. They suggest that in proper training with Chi Flow you should not encounter any pain while training your Kung Fu as your Chi sustains you. Now as I said, this is very different for me, and I have not even begun training Kung Fu with them. Although the idea that being able to train fully and completely, but without any pain is wierd to me, it is also a compelling idea. The Chi Kung techniques I have been learning have proven to be quite potent, providing quick results in a very short period of time. I plan on continuing my training in Shaolin Wahnam.

Nice web site,Remember it is world tai chi/Qi gong day,Saturday April 28,2007.Enjoy this day.Breathing is the best way to relieve stress.Is a way of life. Peace, love, longevity :D :D :!: :!:

Re: SIFU WONG KIEW KIT AND MASTER LIU SIONG
I have been training Shaolin Wahnam Chi Kung for a few weeks now. This is being taught to me as a required prerequisite before I can train Kung Fu. Hi there Denyuan, Thanks for a very interesting post. The Shaolin Wahnam training method sounds very intriguing, to say the least. Forgive me, though, for leaving you with a misleading impression about kung-fu and pain. While my own teacher talks often about the pain factor, he is far from equating kung-fu with pain. IOW, kung-fu is not pain but a state of oneness or harmony between mind and body. This is the Chan teaching of Bodhidharma. However, I see no way to avoid the pain, whether it's physical, mental, or emotional; when travelling the path of self-mastery in the fist-art. But I'll keep an open mind on this and look forward to hearing more from you on this subject. Btw, where's the School located, and what's the tuition like, if you don't mind my asking? Thanks. Warm regards, Yen Hui

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